The conversation about protesting in the midst of a pandemic is becoming more complex and nuanced by the day.

That context is still, of course, completely relevant.

But public health experts and epidemiologists are speaking up more about the other issues that come into play here.

Black Lives Matter LA March crowd

Rich Fury/Getty Images

Right now, the United States is sitting in the middle of two public health crises.

Here are some of the themes that came up repeatedly, based on excerpts from our conversations.

(We chose three quotes for each point that represented the range of responses we received.)

Yes, the protests do increase the risk of transmission.

So, from that perspective, seeing people gathering in mass, of course I worry.

But its pretty difficult to maintain distance from people in a crowd…. And so that is definitely a concern as a public health professional.

But public health messaging hasnt actually changed.

Public health has not backtracked at all.

We said theres a high risk of transmission.

We said theres a high risk with crowds.

We said protesting is dangerous.

In April we were at the peak of our epidemic.

Now we have already prematurely reopened.

And were providing the same advice.

Julia Marcus, Ph.D., M.P.H.

We are taking up the call to guide people through protesting.

Amanda Simanek, Ph.D., M.P.H.

Racism and police brutality are also urgent public health issues.

Jaime Slaughter-Acey, Ph.D.

The protest against racism is in a way a protest against the conditions that have made COVID worse.

Some of the reasons why people are protesting are related to why people are dying from COVID.

The proximate cause of the protest is racial bias and racism in policing.

And that has an immediate effect on the health of people.

Black people who have gotten COVID-19 are [more likely to require hospitalization and die].

Essential front-line workersmany who are people of colorcontinue to be infected at higher rates.

Ranu S. Dhillon, M.D.

Protesting can be a tool for public health.

Sometimes we have to take a long-term view.

Certain police tactics can increase the likelihood of transmission.

Any discussions of risk at the protest needs to include some discussion of whats going on with police.

Julia Marcus, Ph.D., M.P.H.

Amanda Simanek, Ph.D., M.P.H.

We have to find ways to protect protestors from the potential risks associated with this vital collective action.

We have to ensure they have adequate protective equipment like masks and hand sanitizer.

We have to provide open-air public spaces so protestors can effectively distance themselves while demonstrating.

Rhea Boyd M.D., M.P.H.

People are taking a calculated risk in deciding to protest.

Protestors are not stupid.

They recognize that theres risks.

Theyre protesting in spite of the risks.

Abraar Karan M.D, M.P.H.

Theyre not being irresponsible; theyre protesting for a reason.

Standing up to systemic racism and standing up to police brutality is taking priority over risk for COVID-19.

Jaime Slaughter-Acey, Ph.D.

These communities understand the risk of protestingwed be hard pressed to find anyone who doesnt.

So depending on where you fall on that… Regina Davis Moss, Ph.D., M.P.H.

This movement cannot wait until after the pandemic.

A spontaneous massive civil rights movement uprising cant be told to wait until after a pandemic.

We have to recognize human behavior in all of this.

Julia Marcus, Ph.D., M.P.H.

I dont think its even reasonable to even say now we cant protest because theres a pandemic.

We cant just say the pandemic is an inconvenient time for democracy…. That now we have to wait a few more years?

Whats going to happen in a few more years?

Jennifer Nuzzo, Dr.PH.

(One of the reasons why is suppression of Black votingyet another manifestation of systemic racism.)

When George Floyd was murdered, there was no recourse with less transmission risk left but protest.

Ranu S. Dhillon, M.D.